•My favourite humourist, P.G. O’Rourke, came to India when India tested its nukes the second time. He said, “We Americans have nothing to worry about India’s nuclear weapons. Because before India launches a nuclear missile on us, 30 Customs officers will tear it apart and examine every part for exportability.”

I think Indians have this wonderful, almost charming ability to laugh at themselves. That says a lot for you.

•Where would we go if we didn’t?

The Indian bureaucracy has changed a lot since then. Of course, you’ve got a long way to go. But it’s much better than what it was in the past.

•One of the things that you’ve said is that Singapore was governed from Calcutta. The same bureaucracy, the same British system set up the two, isn’t it?

Well, we’re much smaller. Our margins for survival are much narrower. We had to take a more practical approach. And adopt a simpler system. Whereas in your case, it’s a big country, and without two institutions holding the country together, I’ve said this earlier, without the civil service and the army, the idea of a united India would’ve been much more difficult.

•One more thing that not many people know about you is that you were in the Singapore armed forces.

I was in the army and the air force. I remember visiting Khadakvasala in 1988. The National Defence Academy. Because it is a tri-service academy, we wanted to learn from it. There I met the superintendent, a three-star general who was once upon a time a defence attaché in Singapore. He invited me to address a gathering, which I did. It was a very impressive gathering of young cadets. Tall Pathans, people with Mongloid features from the east. There I realised that this is a key institution holding the union together. It was an interesting experience for me. Do you know when I was an officer cadet in 1972, we had to study the law which created the Singapore armed forces. It was a thin document. The instructor told us to refer to the Indian army manual when there was a lacuna, which was a thick red book. Today, you probably still have that thick red book.

... contd.